PSN-L Email List Message

Subject: Re: Seismograph for school
From: "tchannel" tchannel@..............
Date: Tue, 26 Sep 2006 19:20:13 -0600


Hi Stephen,  Thanks for this recommended site...I could not enlarge the =
PSN Preamp and PSN filter Amp by Pete Rowe, to see the values on the =
drawings.  I searched the net but could not find any other site for =
them.  Do you know where I might be abe to find these, large enough to =
print?  Thanks, Ted
  ----- Original Message -----=20
  From: Stephen Hammond=20
  To: psn-l@.................
  Sent: Tuesday, September 26, 2006 11:38 AM
  Subject: RE: Seismograph for school


  Hi, I would like to add a few thoughts. There are some simple plans on =
the PSN San Jose website. =
http://pw2.netcom.com/~shammon1/equip.htm#Plans
  however, I strongly suggest that you look at Larry's WINSDR software / =
equipment because in the classroom, the software environment is one of =
the most important attributes you need to consider. The stability of the =
system hardware and software and the quality of the information provided =
significantly improves the students interaction and learning outcome =
from using the system. For example, if you look at the PSN San Jose main =
page http://www.PublicSeismicNetwork.com you will find two links at the =
bottom left of the page to South Valley Middle School and Los Altos High =
School. Both schools are using WINSDR and Larry's hardware. Initially =
when we built the system at Los Altos we provided a PC, sensors and =
simple amp. At South Valley, Jan Froom went though several steps getting =
to the current system configuration you see today. With the evolution of =
the Internet, there is a real need to incorporate the seismic data into =
the classroom websites. This simplifies the teachers interaction with =
the system and helps to generate significant student/parent interest in =
the project. As you can see from the examples, by using the automatic =
upload feature of Larry's WINSDR, the sensor data is uploaded =
continuously during the 24 hour period. Another benefit is the amount of =
interest the system generates outside of the classroom. Look back at the =
Los Alto page and you will see there have been over 24,000 trips to Greg =
Stoehr's seismic science page at Los Altos High in the last two years. =
Considering that he has about 300 students per semester, this provides a =
40-trip / student page access ratio which is a significant amount of =
return on investment. Greg keeps the system in his classroom and his =
students take part in operating the system during the class year. Greg =
is extremely limited on the amount of time he can spend on the system =
and WINSDR has significantly improved his productivity. With a minimal =
investment, you will see a vast improvement over a simple classroom =
sensor and amp.=20
  Regards, Steve Hammond  PSN San Jose, Aptos California=20

    -----Original Message-----
    From: psn-l-request@.............. =
[mailto:psn-l-request@................. Behalf Of tchannel
    Sent: Tuesday, September 26, 2006 7:38 AM
    To: psn-l@..............
    Subject: Re: Seismograph for school


    Hi John,  Ted here, and I am one month into a similar project, using =
my own money, for a non profit organization.
    We are having a lot of fun on the project, but the electronics are =
challenging, even though I have worked on circuits, I thought I was up =
to it electronic task, but now I am not sure.   I have made some =
progress however, so I think I am getting closer.
    I am happy to share my successes and failures if you would like to =
correspond.  Ted
      ----- Original Message -----=20
      From: John Patskan=20
      To: psn-l@.................
      Sent: Monday, September 25, 2006 11:11 PM
      Subject: Re: Seismograph for school


      Hello everyone,

      Thanks for the tips.

      I believe I will try to build the Lehaman style unit.

      This is actually an elementary school.  It used to be an =
Environmental Science magnet school, and they still have room they call =
the Eco-Lab.  Each class goes in there once a week and the teachers have =
them work on some project.  This year the teachers decided on a Geology =
theme.  I thought a seismograph would be nice to have in the lab.  =
Actually I think the homemade one would be better because the kids could =
get a better idea of how it works.  They wouldn't be doing anything in =
depth but I thought seeing there own siesmograph records may spark some =
interest in science.  I Haven't approached the teachers yet as I want to =
make sure I can pull it off first.=20

      John P


      On 9/23/06, tchannel  wrote:=20
        Hi Chris,  What sort of "choice of suspension system" would you =
recommend? Is there a detail I can look at?=20
        I have only seen the knife edge style.=20
        Thanks, Ted
          ----- Original Message -----=20
          From: ChrisAtUpw@..........
          To: psn-l@.................
          Sent: Saturday, September 23, 2006 5:09 PM
          Subject: Re: Seismograph for school=20


          In a message dated 23/09/2006, jcpatskan@......... writes:
            I am thinking of trying to build a seismograph for my son's =
school. I have quite a bit of experience in shallow exploration =
geophysic's, mostly electrical and electromagnetic, but none in =
seismology.  I have searched the internet and found quite a few =
resources.=20
          Hi John,

              You might consider making a medium sized Lehman - about 2 =
ft long? Say about 1.5 sec period that can be extended to 20 sec?

              You will need +/-12V stabilised power supplies of you may =
buy an amplifier and transformer from Larry at http://psn.quake.net

              Since it will be used with other school systems, I suggest =
that you use Amaseis and buy a DI-154 12 bit ADC still at just $39! =
www.dataq.com Amaseis supports this ADC.=20
              See http://jclahr.com/science/psn/as1/index.html

              Use magnetic damping, NOT oil.=20

              Use an all metal braced single unit costruction - NO =
plastic structural components - NO separated sections.

              Your choice of suspension system is critical. NEITHER a =
point on a plane NOR knife edge systems are satisfactory - avoid them =
like the plague. Most other systems are OK to good. You need to be able =
to get a period of at least 20 seconds.=20

              Have a look at =
http://jclahr.com/science/psn/chapman/lehman/index.html=20
              and http://jclahr.com/science/psn/chapman/index.html
              and http://www.jclahr.com/science/psn/cor_psn.html
              and http://jclahr.com/science/psn/

              ALSO =
http://www.mgm.monschau.de/seismic/english/artikel/artikel_1_4.php  and =
sequels

              I have also noticed a seismograph (or strong motion =
accelerometer) on sale at e-bay, with an opening bid of $75.  =20
              I suggest that you forget this one! You do not need a =
strong motion sensor - or the headaches of converting an optical one. =
This might be called 'buying trouble'!

              Good Luck!

              Chris Chapman









Hi Stephen,  Thanks for this = recommended=20 site...I could not enlarge the PSN Preamp and PSN filter Amp by Pete = Rowe, to=20 see the values on the drawings.  I searched the net but could not = find any=20 other site for them.  Do you know where I might be abe to find = these, large=20 enough to print?  Thanks, Ted
----- Original Message -----
From:=20 Stephen=20 Hammond
To: psn-l@..............
Sent: Tuesday, September 26, = 2006 11:38=20 AM
Subject: RE: Seismograph for = school

Hi,=20 I would like to add a few thoughts. There are some simple plans on the = PSN San=20 Jose website. http://pw2.netco= m.com/~shammon1/equip.htm#Plans
however, I strongly suggest that you look at Larry's WINSDR = software /=20 equipment because in the classroom, the software environment is one of = the=20 most important attributes you need to consider. The stability=20 of the system hardware and software and the quality of the information = provided significantly improves the students interaction and learning = outcome=20 from using the system. For example, if you look at the PSN San = Jose main=20 page http://www.PublicSeismicNet= work.com you=20 will find two links at the bottom left of the page to South = Valley Middle=20 School and Los Altos High School. Both schools are using WINSDR and = Larry's=20 hardware. Initially when we built the system at Los Altos we = provided a=20 PC, sensors and simple amp. At South Valley, Jan Froom went though = several=20 steps getting to the current system configuration you see = today. With=20 the evolution of the Internet, there is a real need to = incorporate the=20 seismic data into the classroom websites. This simplifies the teachers = interaction with the system and helps to generate significant = student/parent=20 interest in the project. As you can see from the examples, by using = the=20 automatic upload feature of Larry's WINSDR, the sensor data is = uploaded=20 continuously during the 24 hour period. Another benefit is the amount = of=20 interest the system generates outside of the classroom. Look back at = the Los=20 Alto page and you will see there have been over 24,000 trips to = Greg=20 Stoehr's seismic science page at Los Altos High in the last two years. = Considering that he has about 300 students per semester, this provides = a=20 40-trip / student page access ratio which is a significant amount = of=20 return on investment. Greg keeps the system in his classroom and = his=20 students take part in operating the system during the class year. Greg = is=20 extremely limited on the amount of time he can spend on the system and = WINSDR=20 has significantly improved his productivity. With a minimal = investment, you=20 will see a vast improvement over a simple classroom sensor and amp.=20
Regards, Steve Hammond  PSN San Jose, Aptos=20 California 
 
-----Original Message-----
From:=20 psn-l-request@.............. = [mailto:psn-l-request@...............On=20 Behalf Of tchannel
Sent: Tuesday, September 26, 2006 = 7:38=20 AM
To: psn-l@..............
Subject: Re: = Seismograph for=20 school

Hi John,  Ted here, and I am = one month=20 into a similar project, using my own money, for a non profit=20 organization.
We are having a lot of fun on the = project, but=20 the electronics are challenging, even though I have worked on = circuits, I=20 thought I was up to it electronic task, but now I am not = sure.   I=20 have made some progress however, so I think I am getting=20 closer.
I am happy to share my successes = and failures=20 if you would like to correspond.  Ted
----- Original Message ----- =
From:=20 John=20 Patskan
Sent: Monday, September 25, = 2006=20 11:11 PM
Subject: Re: Seismograph = for=20 school

Hello everyone,

Thanks for the = tips.

I=20 believe I will try to build the Lehaman style unit.

This is = actually an elementary school.  It used to be an = Environmental=20 Science magnet school, and they still have room they call the = Eco-Lab.=20  Each class goes in there once a week and the teachers have = them work=20 on some project.  This year the teachers decided on a Geology = theme.=20  I thought a seismograph would be nice to have in the lab.=20  Actually I think the homemade one would be better because = the kids=20 could get a better idea of how it works.  They wouldn't be = doing=20 anything in depth but I thought seeing there own siesmograph = records may=20 spark some interest in science.  I Haven't approached the = teachers=20 yet as I want to make sure I can pull it off first.

John = P

On 9/23/06, tchannel <tchannel@..............>=20 wrote:=20
Hi Chris,  What sort of "choice of suspension system" = would=20 you recommend? Is there a detail I can look at?
I have only seen the knife edge style.
Thanks, Ted
----- Original Message = -----
From: ChrisAtUpw@.......=20
To: psn-l@..............
Sent: Saturday, = September 23,=20 2006 5:09 PM
Subject: Re: = Seismograph for=20 school

In a message dated 23/09/2006, jcpatskan@............ writes:
I am thinking of trying to build a seismograph for = my son's=20 school. I have quite a bit of experience in shallow = exploration=20 geophysic's, mostly electrical and electromagnetic, but none = in=20 seismology.  I have searched the internet and found = quite a few=20 resources.
Hi John,
 
    You might consider making a = medium sized=20 Lehman - about 2 ft long? Say about 1.5 sec period that can be = extended to 20 sec?
 
    You will need +/-12V stabilised = power=20 supplies of you may buy an amplifier and transformer from = Larry at http://psn.quake.net
 
    Since it will be used with other = school=20 systems, I suggest that you use = Amaseis and buy=20 a DI-154 12 bit ADC still at just $39! = www.dataq.com Amaseis=20 supports this ADC.
    See http://jclahr.com/science/psn/as1/index.html
 
    Use magnetic damping, NOT oil.
 
    Use an all metal braced single = unit=20 costruction - NO plastic structural components - NO separated=20 sections.
 
    Your choice of suspension system is = critical.=20 NEITHER a point on a plane NOR knife edge systems are = satisfactory -=20 avoid them like the plague. Most other systems are OK to good. = You=20 need to be able to get a period of at least 20 seconds.
 
    Have a look at http://jclahr.com/science/psn/chapman/lehman/index.html=20
    and http://jclahr.com/science/psn/chapman/index.html
    and http://www.jclahr.com/science/psn/cor_psn.html
    and http://jclahr.com/science/psn/
 
    ALSO http://www.mgm.monschau.de/seismic/english/artikel/artike= l_1_4.php=20  and sequels
 
    I have also = noticed a=20 = seismograph (or strong motion accelerometer) on=20 sale at e-bay, with an opening bid of $75.   =
    I suggest that you=20 forget this one! You do not need a = strong motion=20 sensor - or the headaches of converting an optical one. This = might be=20 called 'buying trouble'!
 
    Good Luck!
 
    Chris Chapman
=
 


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