----- Original Message -----=20
From: Jim and Connie Lehman=20
To: psn-l@.................
Sent: Wednesday, August 11, 2010 11:00 AM
Subject: Re: Faraday's Law


Mike--an interesting question.  N & S poles spaced apart create a strong =
straight geometry of lines of force between them.  N to N spaced apart =
would show a "squished" field with lines of force leaving and bending =
backward.  A coil placed in a N to N setting would show some output, but =
nothing like the N to S.
  Bear in mind, lines of force are fictitious but you get an idea of =
their presence by placing a glass plate over N to S spaced closely, and =
sprinkling iron filings over the area.  Do likewise with N to N, and you =
will see a big difference.
   In the typical Lehman coil/magnet arrangement the ideal is to place =
half the pickup coil in the magnetic N to S gap so that the wires in =
that part of the coil are perpendicular to the strong field lines.  Then =
any movement of coil or magnet will induce a current output from the =
coil.
Keep up the good work-Jim
  ----- Original Message -----=20
  From: Mike Lozano=20
  To: psn-l@.................
  Sent: Monday, August 09, 2010 7:43 PM
  Subject: RE: Faraday's Law


  Hi everyone,

  =20

  Here's a question I've always wanted to ask:  Why (if the number of =
magnetic lines of force cut per unit time produces a current flow) is it =
not possible to force two identical magnets together so that they're =
oriented (for example) N pole to N pole.  It seems to me that the lines =
of force would crowd together so that the least movement of them would =
produce quite a strong response in a coil.=20

  =20

  I built a simple vertical seismometer with a 5 pound plumber's lead as =
the weight, a spring and two cow magnets forced together in a tube of =
PVC so that the resting position in the coil was the point at which the =
maximum lines of force resided.  It made a lot of sense when I designed =
it but I didn't have a good environment in which to test it; e.g. A 500 =
foot TV station antenna within 50 feet; an expressway two blocks away =
and a location inside a TV studio.  To be sure, it was a short period =
sensor. =20

  =20

  I'm not a seismologist (that should be quite evident) . I'm a retired =
electrical engineer who specialized in grounding and lightning damage =
risk mitigation.  In case you're wondering about the TV station stuff, I =
made my living as a Meteorologist (my 2nd degree).  If my idea is dumb =
please excuse me - I was just very curious about this and thought I'd =
write and ask.

  =20

  Miguel Lozano

  Lockhart, TX, USA

  =20

  From: psn-l-request@.............. =
[mailto:psn-l-request@............... On Behalf Of Ted Channel
  Sent: Monday, August 09, 2010 9:36 AM
  To: psn
  Subject: Faraday's Law

  =20

  Hi Folks,  I have used a simple tubular coil and ring magnet assm. in =
a number of sensors.   Yet I still have unanswered questions about =
Faraday's Law.

  =20

  http://hyperphysics.phy-astr.gsu.edu/hbase/electric/farlaw.html   I =
have never taken the time to test all the configurations, but now is a =
good time.   Before I begin I wanted to ask someone, who understand it =
or who actually has done these tests.

  =20

  Here are my questions...............Looking at this wed page, there is =
a simple, tubular coil.   The illustration shows only one pole of the =
magnet entering the coil.   The formula and examples I believe I =
understand.    However What happens, when both poles are inside the =
coil, say a small ring magnet 1/4" thick.   Now things are not clear.   =
Is there a cancelling effect?    With both north and south poles inside =
the coil, I would think this would be the case.    To keep this =
understandable, let's not consider any magnets on the outside of the =
coil.

  =20

  I see these possibilities. =20

  1 One pole entering the coil, as shown, when it move in one direction =
it produces + voltage, when it move in the opposite direction, - =
voltage.  This is the only arrangement I have used.

  2. Both poles inside the coil, when it move in one direction.........? =
  When it moves in the opposite direction....?

  3. Two magnets, one entering and one exiting, with like poles facing =
each other.   When they move, at the same time, in one =
direction..........?  When they move, at the same time, in the other =
direction?

  4.  Two magnets, one entering and one exiting, with opposite poles =
facing each other.  When they move, at the same time, in one =
direction....?  When they move, at the same time, in the other =
direction?

  =20

  I am going to run this simple test........but would like someone to =
explain, before,  what I should see.

  =20

  Thanks,

  Ted







 
----- Original Message -----=20
From: Jim =
and Connie=20
Lehman 
To: psn-l@.............. 
Sent: Wednesday, August 11, 2010 11:00 AM
Subject: Re: Faraday's Law


Mike--an interesting question.  N =
&=20
S poles spaced apart create a strong straight geometry of lines of =
force=20
between them.  N to N spaced apart would show a "squished" field =
with lines=20
of force leaving and bending backward.  A coil placed in a N to N =
setting=20
would show some output, but nothing like the N to S.
  Bear in mind, lines of force are =
fictitious=20
but you get an idea of their presence by placing a glass plate over N to =
S=20
spaced closely, and sprinkling iron filings over the area.  Do =
likewise=20
with N to N, and you will see a big difference.
   In the typical Lehman =
coil/magnet=20
arrangement the ideal is to place half the pickup coil in the =
magnetic=20
N to S gap so that the wires in that part of the coil are =
perpendicular=20
to the strong field lines.  Then any movement of coil or =
magnet will=20
induce a current output from the coil.
Keep up the good work-Jim

  
----- Original Message ----- 
  From:=20
  Mike=20
  Lozano 
  
To: psn-l@.............. 
  
Sent: Monday, August 09, 2010 =
7:43=20
  PM
  
Subject: RE: Faraday's =
Law
  


  

  
Hi=20
  everyone,
  
 
  
Here=92s=20
  a question I=92ve always wanted to ask:  Why (if the number of =
magnetic=20
  lines of force cut per unit time produces a current flow) is it not =
possible=20
  to force two identical magnets together so that they=92re oriented =
(for example)=20
  N pole to N pole.  It seems to me that the lines of force would =
crowd=20
  together so that the least movement of them would produce quite a =
strong=20
  response in a coil. 
  
 
  
I=20
  built a simple vertical seismometer with a 5 pound plumber=92s lead as =
the=20
  weight, a spring and two cow magnets forced together in a tube of PVC =
so that=20
  the resting position in the coil was the point at which the maximum =
lines of=20
  force resided.  It made a lot of sense when I designed it but I =
didn=92t=20
  have a good environment in which to test it; e.g. A 500 foot TV =
station=20
  antenna within 50 feet; an expressway two blocks away and a location =
inside a=20
  TV studio.  To be sure, it was a short period sensor. =20
  
  
 
  
I=92m=20
  not a seismologist (that should be quite evident) =85 I=92m a retired =
electrical=20
  engineer who specialized in grounding and lightning damage risk=20
  mitigation.  In case you=92re wondering about the TV station =
stuff, I made=20
  my living as a Meteorologist (my 2nd degree).  If my =
idea is=20
  dumb please excuse me =96 I was just very curious about this and =
thought I=92d=20
  write and ask.
  
 
  
Miguel=20
  Lozano
  
Lockhart,=20
  TX, USA
  
 
  

  
  
From:=20
  psn-l-request@.............. [mailto:psn-l-request@............... =
On=20
  Behalf Of Ted Channel
Sent: Monday, August 09, 2010 9:36 =

  AM
To: psn
Subject: Faraday's=20
  Law
  
 
  

  
Hi =
Folks,  I=20
  have used a simple tubular coil and ring magnet assm. in a number of=20
  sensors.   Yet I still have unanswered questions about =
Faraday's=20
  Law.
  

  
 
  

  
=
http://hyperphysics.phy-astr.gsu.edu/hbase/electric/farlaw.html =
 =20
  I have never taken the time to test all the configurations, but now is =
a good=20
  time.   Before I begin I wanted to ask someone, who =
understand it or=20
  who actually has done these tests.
  

  
 
  

  
Here are my=20
  questions...............Looking at this wed page, there is a simple, =
tubular=20
  coil.   The illustration shows only one pole of the magnet =
entering=20
  the coil.   The formula and examples I believe I=20
  understand.    However What happens, when both =
poles are=20
  inside the coil, say a small ring magnet 1/4" thick.   =
Now=20
  things are not clear.   Is there a cancelling=20
  effect?    With both north and south poles inside the =
coil, I=20
  would think this would be the case.    To keep this=20
  understandable, let's not consider any magnets on the outside of the=20
  coil.
  

  
 
  

  
I see =
these=20
  possibilities.  
  

  
1 One =
pole entering=20
  the coil, as shown, when it move in one direction it produces + =
voltage, when=20
  it move in the opposite direction, - voltage.  This is the only=20
  arrangement I have used.
  

  
2. Both =
poles=20
  inside the coil, when it move in one direction.........?   =
When it=20
  moves in the opposite direction....?
  

  
3. Two =
magnets, one=20
  entering and one exiting, with like poles facing each =
other.   When=20
  they move, at the same time, in one direction..........?  =
When they=20
  move, at the same time, in the other =
direction?
  

  
4.  =
Two=20
  magnets, one entering and one exiting, with opposite poles facing each =

  other.  When they move, at the same time, in one =
direction....? =20
  When they move, at the same time, in the other=20
  direction?
  

  
 
  

  
I am =
going to run=20
  this simple test........but would like someone to explain, before, =
 what=20
  I should see.
  

  
 
  

  
Thanks,
  

  
Ted
<=
/BODY>