PSN-L Email List Message
Subject: Re: nonlinearities
From: Brett Nordgren brett3nt@.............
Date: Fri, 19 Aug 2011 09:03:09 -0400
Hi Chris,
I just had a couple of comments on your thread with Dave.
>>Regarding creep effects -- When a spring is first installed in an
>>instrument there will be "pops" related to what is probably
>>dislocation effects in the spring material . Their frequency will
>>gradually reduce in time. The solution is to bake the assembly,
>>with the spring at its operational stress, at ~ 160 C for several
>>hours. This will essentially eliminate the effect.
>
>I wish it were that simple. Heat treating the spring under tension
>does greatly reduce the noise, but it doesn't eliminate it.
I'm sure you're correct. What Dave meant was just that after baking
we can no longer see that type of noise in the output signal.
>You also have noise from the feedback circuit. Differentiating a
>signal is a noisy process.
That's one I don't agree with. Are you implying, then, that if you
integrate a signal you can remove noise? Don't think so, and
differentiating, done properly, shouldn't add noise either. That
would seem to imply that if you differentiate a signal, then
re-integrate it, it will now contain additional noise just because of
the differentiation process. I believe differentiation simply
accentuates frequency components in the signal which are typically
noisy. In a feedback seismometer, the derivative feedback is
strongest at the high frequencies where it acts to most strongly
cancel/offset high frequency noise. The more high frequency noise
the derivative feedback branch passes, the more it will get reduced
in the instrument output.
>It could be a distinct advantage to combine active damping with
>passive damping, which is quieter.
Our approach has been to seek the maximum Q possible in the passive
spring-mass system in order to keep as far away as possible from any
1/MTQ effects (though that's not likely to be an issue). Normally,
air damping from the displacement-sensor plates is the limiting
factor on what Q we can get. Then we independently design the
feedback to shape the low corner of the instrument's velocity
response to provide something like critical damping. The two Q's are
pretty much separate issues.
Regards,
Brett
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