On 7/14/2012 2:48 PM, sismos@.............. wrote:
> On 07/14/2012 12:38 AM, Thomas Dick wrote:
>> On 7/13/2012 5:55 PM, Dave Nelson wrote:
>>> The number of possible seismic instrument configurations which will 
>>> provide some response  to seismic motions is vast. The question is 
>>> the practicality/utility of a given configuration.
>>> The key figure of merit for any instrument configuration  is the 
>>> instrument self noise and response as a function of frequency. This 
>>> directly determines the minimum seismic motion the instrument is 
>>> capable of detecting and then providing useful data for analysis.
>>> If one is willing to wait for that rare magnitude 7 or 8 event the 
>>> simplest / noisiest instrument may do the job in some contexts, such 
>>> as classroom demonstrations .
>>> The amateur astronomer community has evolved to the point where it 
>>> provides useful  ( if not essential) information to the astronomy 
>>> scientific community. I believe the amateur seismology community 
>>> could do a similar service but not with inadequate instrumentation.
>>>  The goal should be to develop amateur instruments with 
>>> characteristics near the performance of professional instruments and 
>>> then operating  them in reasonably low noise sites. (An instrument 
>>> in a residential basement  will work reassembly well if carefully 
>>> done.)
>>> Larry Cochrane has  already provided us with  excellent equipment to 
>>> handle the sensor data and connect it to a network. Some work needs 
>>> to be done in this area but we have a good start.
>>> _*My challenge is to include instrument self noise and generator 
>>> constant, both as a function of frequency, as a FIRST PRIORITY when 
>>> evaluating  the utility of an instrument concept. *_
>>> Just another gadget that will respond if you shake it is not where 
>>> we want to spend our efforts and resources.
>>> I do  NOT  mean to imply there are not some truly innovative and 
>>> possibly revolutionary ideas out there but we should  look at each 
>>> of them  carefully to determine early whether they justify 
>>> significant effort or belong in the "that was interesting" stack.
>>> Just where determination is made is a personal choice but it should 
>>> be based on some form of analysis and/or test.
>>> Comments Please.
>>> Dave Nelson
>>> Rolling Hills Estates, California
>> My impression is that most academia and professional seismologists 
>> hold the amateur in very low esteem.
>
> Yes, they do hold us in low esteem and this is our own fault.
>
> We have noisy instruments
> We do not calibrate
> We do not have accurate time
> We do not use a standard format for data exchange
> We do not use standard naming conventions
>
> The academic and professional seismologists can already locate and 
> characterize (within a few minutes) all events over about 4.2 Mb, They 
> don't need us for that.  Where we could excel and make a meaningful 
> contribution is in the seismicity of our own backyards, the small 
> events less than one degree from our instruments. Recording those is a 
> bit harder than picking up the squiggles from a 6.5 Mb 10 degrees away.
>
> These are just a few things we do and do not do and until we do we 
> will just be amateurs.
>
> Just my two cents
>
> Angel
>
>
>
>
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> Well, Angel you are painfully right. Things are changing....; but my 
> experiences; years ago, I had trouble with a Biologoy experiment in an 
> high school  BSCS class and the local college gave me the equipment to 
> run the experiment. Another time, I was grinding an 8 inch mirror for 
> a reflector telescope and had trouble -- IU at Bloomington helped me. 
> Early on into my building siesmic detectors I ask  what something was 
> on my seismic display. The reply was my timing was off by over a 
> minute. That is when I went to satellite timing using Larry's unit. 
> The problem with academia (today) is the publish or parish mandate 
> they live under.

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